McCain v. Clinton: talk about a choice between "bad" and "worse"!
keemo
· 1 year ago
McCain v. Clinton: a choice between a 70's Democrat and a modern day Socialist thug.
njcommuter
· 1 year ago
I'll take a Scoop Jackson Democrat over a claim-it-all populist panderer and hypocrite any day, especially if the panderer is a 2007 Democrat.
RJD
· 1 year ago
When are conservatives going to wise up on McCain. There is a huge difference between McCain and Clinton. Think of Reid and Pelosi as president. How often did McCain vote with them? 83% ACU rating. We are letting fringe movements dictate the direction of this country.
Get over immigration. The only alternative to some permanent status to long term illegals is mass deportation. Noboby has advocated that. Attrition is the domestic policy equivilent of aligning with dictators because they are "our guy" It is easy to rationalize it as a solution but it doesn't work. What do Jack Kemp, Dick Armey, Martin Feldman, all respected economic voices have in common. And Frank Keating, respected former governor of Oklahoma.
Interestingly, opponents of McCain rarely talk about why they like their candidates but criticize McCain. That irrationality is telling. All of the candidates have something I don't like, with McCain its his position on global warming but the likelihood of a carbon tax being passed is very low. Thompson is great on the issues but he has shot himself in the foot with his campaign's incompetence. Rudy is quickly doing the same thing. The others are a joke.
The Yell
· 1 year ago
But...didn't Rasmussen say the same thing about Obama in New Hampshire last week?
Lightwave
· 1 year ago
Given the bitter partisan divide between the Clinton camp and the Obama camp, these numbers are only going to get worse. My money's still on Hillary for the Democrats. But her victory in the primaries will be Pyrrhic at best, and at worst, it will split the Democrats completely.
McCain's numbers with African-American voters are also pretty telling. More and more of them, particularly the large number of Christian voters in that group, are voting Republican. By no means are they firmly in the GOP big tent as a whole, but many of them are coming around to the Republican party on values issues in general.
But seeing how both McCain and Huckabee (a man who supposedly doesn't have any pull among independents) would beat Hillary, I stand by my prediction from last year: the Dems will nominate her. And the Dems will lose across the board on the big three "I's": Increased taxes, Illegal Immigration, and Iraq.
gaffo
· 1 year ago
agreed.
if the dems are dumb enough to nominate her over Obama they will have blown the general election. I fear they are dumb enough.
In the general Obama would do better than Billary.
.................
your side has a similar problem - you guys (the base) would like to jetison McCain and nominate Romney.
if you do that you will be doing the same thing as the Democrats - blowing a chance to win the General election.
Mark E.
· 1 year ago
Ed, I've watched McCain's poll numbers at Rasmussen for weeks now and he has soundly beating Hillary. If you go to Real Clear Politics poll section you will also see that McCain is beating Hillary in ALL of the major polls, the only Republican to do so. He's running fairly even vs. Obama at this point though I think if the two squared off that would change in favor of McCain. He appears to be the strongest one in the GOP field right now and I am quite happy about it and appear to be one of the few out there as I encounter a lot of people who really dislike McCain.
Mark E.
· 1 year ago
RJD, I agree that some of McCain's positions drive me nuts and think too many people are overboard in almost hating the guy but at least I know that McCain believes these things and took the time to look into them and if approached respectfully he may be swayed but is a decent man and doesn't deserve the thrashings he gets.
Snooper
· 1 year ago
And how about Czarina taking credit for The Troop Surge?
olddeadmeat
· 1 year ago
By the general election, our economy will have plunged into deep recession, and the general public will be screaming for "change."
That climate will be Hillarobama's dream environment for winning the election. The only thought that amuses me about that is Jesse Jackson will undoubtedly be pouting and drinking straight from the bottle all winter.
The GOP will need a candidate who can pull the moderates.
Who has done that in the past? McCain.
Who publicly disagreed with Bush and was proven right in the end? McCain.
docjim - there's bad as in cheap beer or in box wine, and then there is bad as in raw sewage. From where I sit, that's the choice between the worst credible GOP candidate (Paul doesn't count) and the best on the Dem field right now.
We are heading for rough times, and I want a real leader in the White House for a change.
NoDonkey
· 1 year ago
I agree. I'm going to vote for McCain in the Virginia primary because there is no way I want to see a Democrat in the White House.
I don't agree with all of McCain's positions, but he's by far the best alternative. Romney isn't electable and neither is Huckabee. Thompson isn't running hard enough.
McCain, for all his faults, is a good man and a fine American. Hillary or Obama, whatever their virtues (and for Hillary, there ain't much), are far too inexperienced and unqualified to put into the White House.
I just wrote on this subject this morning. None of these polls apparently mean squat at this point, as I can find two sets of results in virtually every matchup question (including the one you quote about McCain) which directly contradict each other. These pollsters are pulling numbers out of their collective asses at this point.
Micah_B_Free
· 1 year ago
"The lesser of two evils" choice is the general election. Vote for whom you think is best in the primaries. I don't care if Thompson isn't slobbered on by the media, he's got the best conservative positions, hands down, and he'll get my vote in March, even if I have to write him in! Voting on whom you think will do better in November is BS! That is NOT what the primaries are for. Remember, Bill Clinton ran a great campain in '92. He had lots of "fire", and was quite energetic, too. How wonderful.
unclesmrgol
· 1 year ago
How do things break out by state? We all understand now that the popular vote does not always determine the election. Again, how do things break out by state?
SwabJockey05
· 1 year ago
I agree with some of my shipmates in that McCain is a good man. Bonafide war hero. But many of you who say you’ll vote for him do so because you are “single issue” voters…you want the best “man” for the war effort.
I submit that if you are a “war” as a single issue voter, the best man for the job…isn’t a man.
Do you think McCain is any more “for the war” than Bush is…? Do you think he would be any more focused on “seeing it through” than Bush has been? Do you think the Dhimmicrats and their PR arm in the MSM are going to cut McCain some slack if he wins the WH? Isn’t it a safer bet to count on them to continue their current SOP of bashing the Republican party?
While it’s true that for a Repub, McCain has been the darling of the MSM. It’s probably that because of that darling status, he will be shell-shocked and “betrayed” when they begin sabotaging his administration…a sabotage mission which will begin before he’s even sworn in…
Hillary! will not immediately surrender in Iraq. Because she’s a dhimmicrat, the MSM will likely cut her some slack…who knows, they may even credit her with “fixing” the quagmire in Iraq. If you are a “single issue” voter, do you really care who gets “credit” for fixing … or winning … in Iraq? Why should anyone care if Hildabeast, Pelousy and Dingy get the credit? The GWOT is largely and Information War. To have a chance at winning, we need the MSM to choose to voluntarily helping us with the fight. Only Hildabeast and her followers have a chance at getting the MSM to be “on our side” in this information war…
This swabbie ain’t shilling for the Beast…far from it. He’s just trying to make the point that you should not vote for a Republican because you think that Repub will be “the best one” to fight the GWOT. You should vote for the best overall person for the Presidency…one that is most closely aligned with you on all the different policies that the executive department should persue…Don’t vote for McCain because you agree with him on the war…but you disagree with him on taxes, immigration, free speech etc etc…
runawayyyy
· 1 year ago
Interesting analysis swabbie. But I would suggest a little historical perspective wrt the war issue. Specifically, the Vietnam war. Democrats got us into that war, then democrats sabotaged the effort, and now democrats still get to use it against the republicans that didn't get us into it and didn't lose it. You talk about an information war, so I'd like to add this data point to make it clear that no matter who wins the Iraq war, ultimately the democrats will take the credit. And this is keeping in mind everything they've done right out in the open to sabotage this one as well. Chances are, they'll get away with it again.
SwabJockey05
· 1 year ago
Agree, shipmate.
But wether they "get away with it again" or not isn't the point. If they "get away with it" or "get all the credit" who cares? If you're a single issue voter, by definition, all you care about is winning the "war" not who gets credit.
IMO Hillary (with the MSM on her side) will have much more success than a War Hero like McCain, who will be pounded non-stop by the cowardly Dhimmicrats (yes COWARDS who don't even have the dignity to hide their faces as they bash the troops while still funding the "war") and their "free" PR arm in the MSM.
We will pull out of Iraq soon...how the pullout is portrayed by the MSM will have HUGE impact to the momentum of change in that country.
njcommuter
· 1 year ago
"Do you think McCain is any more “for the war” than Bush is…? Do you think he would be any more focused on “seeing it through” than Bush has been?"
Unlike his father, Dubya has "the vision thing." The war in Iraq has long-term strategic import, and represents a chance to reshape the Middle East, as the projected Security Agreement shows. While I'm not really pleased at having another overseas commitment for American forces, it's a damn sight better than what we had before.
We need a president who has the same Vision Thing, who thinks in terms of strategy and (if possible) Grand Strategy, and who can see and sieze opportunities. To misquote Reagan, it's amazing how much you can get done if you don't care if you're blamed for it.
SwabJockey05
· 1 year ago
Agree NJ. But I didn't mean Bush wasn't "seeing it through"...quite the contrary. He's been steadfast in spite of the fact that he's portrayed as an "evil" and "heartless" tyrant (by would-be tyrants no less…)
What I meant was that McCain will not be as steadfast as Bush has been…no matter how many times he (McCain) tells you that he will be….he will not be able to withstand the MSM onslaught. His previous “favored son” status with the MSM will cause him to cave to all the negative press and constant hammering by the cowardly (and short-sighted / stupid) Dhimmicrats.
While runaway made good points, I still maintain that if you’re truly a “single issue” voter (ie: the war issue trumps all others…) Hillary (with the MSM on her side) is the best candidate.
All Comments
Get over immigration. The only alternative to some permanent status to long term illegals is mass deportation. Noboby has advocated that. Attrition is the domestic policy equivilent of aligning with dictators because they are "our guy" It is easy to rationalize it as a solution but it doesn't work. What do Jack Kemp, Dick Armey, Martin Feldman, all respected economic voices have in common. And Frank Keating, respected former governor of Oklahoma.
Interestingly, opponents of McCain rarely talk about why they like their candidates but criticize McCain. That irrationality is telling. All of the candidates have something I don't like, with McCain its his position on global warming but the likelihood of a carbon tax being passed is very low. Thompson is great on the issues but he has shot himself in the foot with his campaign's incompetence. Rudy is quickly doing the same thing. The others are a joke.
McCain's numbers with African-American voters are also pretty telling. More and more of them, particularly the large number of Christian voters in that group, are voting Republican. By no means are they firmly in the GOP big tent as a whole, but many of them are coming around to the Republican party on values issues in general.
But seeing how both McCain and Huckabee (a man who supposedly doesn't have any pull among independents) would beat Hillary, I stand by my prediction from last year: the Dems will nominate her. And the Dems will lose across the board on the big three "I's": Increased taxes, Illegal Immigration, and Iraq.
if the dems are dumb enough to nominate her over Obama they will have blown the general election. I fear they are dumb enough.
In the general Obama would do better than Billary.
.................
your side has a similar problem - you guys (the base) would like to jetison McCain and nominate Romney.
if you do that you will be doing the same thing as the Democrats - blowing a chance to win the General election.
I've watched McCain's poll numbers at Rasmussen for weeks now and he has soundly beating Hillary. If you go to Real Clear Politics poll section you will also see that McCain is beating Hillary in ALL of the major polls, the only Republican to do so. He's running fairly even vs. Obama at this point though I think if the two squared off that would change in favor of McCain. He appears to be the strongest one in the GOP field right now and I am quite happy about it and appear to be one of the few out there as I encounter a lot of people who really dislike McCain.
I agree that some of McCain's positions drive me nuts and think too many people are overboard in almost hating the guy but at least I know that McCain believes these things and took the time to look into them and if approached respectfully he may be swayed but is a decent man and doesn't deserve the thrashings he gets.
That climate will be Hillarobama's dream environment for winning the election. The only thought that amuses me about that is Jesse Jackson will undoubtedly be pouting and drinking straight from the bottle all winter.
The GOP will need a candidate who can pull the moderates.
Who has done that in the past? McCain.
Who publicly disagreed with Bush and was proven right in the end? McCain.
docjim - there's bad as in cheap beer or in box wine, and then there is bad as in raw sewage. From where I sit, that's the choice between the worst credible GOP candidate (Paul doesn't count) and the best on the Dem field right now.
We are heading for rough times, and I want a real leader in the White House for a change.
I don't agree with all of McCain's positions, but he's by far the best alternative. Romney isn't electable and neither is Huckabee. Thompson isn't running hard enough.
McCain, for all his faults, is a good man and a fine American. Hillary or Obama, whatever their virtues (and for Hillary, there ain't much), are far too inexperienced and unqualified to put into the White House.
I just wrote on this subject this morning. None of these polls apparently mean squat at this point, as I can find two sets of results in virtually every matchup question (including the one you quote about McCain) which directly contradict each other. These pollsters are pulling numbers out of their collective asses at this point.
Vote for whom you think is best in the primaries.
I don't care if Thompson isn't slobbered on by the media, he's got the best conservative positions, hands down, and he'll get my vote in March, even if I have to write him in!
Voting on whom you think will do better in November is BS! That is NOT what the primaries are for.
Remember, Bill Clinton ran a great campain in '92. He had lots of "fire", and was quite energetic, too. How wonderful.
I submit that if you are a “war” as a single issue voter, the best man for the job…isn’t a man.
Do you think McCain is any more “for the war” than Bush is…? Do you think he would be any more focused on “seeing it through” than Bush has been? Do you think the Dhimmicrats and their PR arm in the MSM are going to cut McCain some slack if he wins the WH? Isn’t it a safer bet to count on them to continue their current SOP of bashing the Republican party?
While it’s true that for a Repub, McCain has been the darling of the MSM. It’s probably that because of that darling status, he will be shell-shocked and “betrayed” when they begin sabotaging his administration…a sabotage mission which will begin before he’s even sworn in…
Hillary! will not immediately surrender in Iraq. Because she’s a dhimmicrat, the MSM will likely cut her some slack…who knows, they may even credit her with “fixing” the quagmire in Iraq. If you are a “single issue” voter, do you really care who gets “credit” for fixing … or winning … in Iraq? Why should anyone care if Hildabeast, Pelousy and Dingy get the credit? The GWOT is largely and Information War. To have a chance at winning, we need the MSM to choose to voluntarily helping us with the fight. Only Hildabeast and her followers have a chance at getting the MSM to be “on our side” in this information war…
This swabbie ain’t shilling for the Beast…far from it. He’s just trying to make the point that you should not vote for a Republican because you think that Repub will be “the best one” to fight the GWOT. You should vote for the best overall person for the Presidency…one that is most closely aligned with you on all the different policies that the executive department should persue…Don’t vote for McCain because you agree with him on the war…but you disagree with him on taxes, immigration, free speech etc etc…
But wether they "get away with it again" or not isn't the point. If they "get away with it" or "get all the credit" who cares? If you're a single issue voter, by definition, all you care about is winning the "war" not who gets credit.
IMO Hillary (with the MSM on her side) will have much more success than a War Hero like McCain, who will be pounded non-stop by the cowardly Dhimmicrats (yes COWARDS who don't even have the dignity to hide their faces as they bash the troops while still funding the "war") and their "free" PR arm in the MSM.
We will pull out of Iraq soon...how the pullout is portrayed by the MSM will have HUGE impact to the momentum of change in that country.
Unlike his father, Dubya has "the vision thing." The war in Iraq has long-term strategic import, and represents a chance to reshape the Middle East, as the projected Security Agreement shows. While I'm not really pleased at having another overseas commitment for American forces, it's a damn sight better than what we had before.
We need a president who has the same Vision Thing, who thinks in terms of strategy and (if possible) Grand Strategy, and who can see and sieze opportunities. To misquote Reagan, it's amazing how much you can get done if you don't care if you're blamed for it.
What I meant was that McCain will not be as steadfast as Bush has been…no matter how many times he (McCain) tells you that he will be….he will not be able to withstand the MSM onslaught. His previous “favored son” status with the MSM will cause him to cave to all the negative press and constant hammering by the cowardly (and short-sighted / stupid) Dhimmicrats.
While runaway made good points, I still maintain that if you’re truly a “single issue” voter (ie: the war issue trumps all others…) Hillary (with the MSM on her side) is the best candidate.